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Episode VIII: The Last Star Wars Thread

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Robotic
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and RLM has a good point, why is he acting like fake crazy wild Yoda

 

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See, I don't get this criticism. He was acting with about the same temperament he had in Jedi.

 

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VGFM
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Yeah, I was generally under the impression that the "wacky" side of Yoda wasn't a complete charade, just an exaggeration of his normal temperament.

 

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Robotic
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If anything, the prequels are a flanderization of the brief flashes of seriousness Yoda had. People remember that stuff because it was contextualized so well since Yoda is a complete goofball for the vast majority of his screentime. He's supposed to be funny, and while he was testing Luke by feigning ignorance and insanity when they first meet, he maintained a similar slightly manic and lighthearted attitude throughout the rest of his appearances. And that's how TLJ's Yoda acts too: he gives wisdom and doesn't take things super seriously.

 

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JazzDanceForChildren

Not going to spoiler this since it's only RotJ spoilers, but there's a radio drama adaptation of the original 3 movies made by the BBC that actually starts off really good, but the quality gradually degrades until RotJ is just a cacophony of nonsense alien sounds. A few years ago I was listening through it while doing some data entry work and this webpage I was on made a cartoon spring sound effect at the exact moment of Yoda's death and it took several seconds for me to realize that it wasn't part of the recording.

For what it's worth though, the BBC's radio adaptation of A New Hope is pretty good even though some of the scenes had to be reworked without the visual element. I think A New Hope is about four and a half hours and the new scenes they added actually work pretty well.

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Biodegradable

Mark Hamill having a bit of fun.

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SharkhamAsylum

I saw The Last Jedi! I guess the best way I can articulate my feelings about it is that it's simultaneously the best and worst Star Wars movie. I have a mountain of little problems with it, and the film as a whole feels like it breaks down when you take it all in at once, but moment-to-moment it's really good and it delivers on so many incredible things.

Spoiler

I felt like having the old Jedi books intact and recovered at the end (in the drawer from which Finn gets the blanket for Rose) was a really insulting way to renege on what I really appreciated as a point the film was making, that the traditional Jedi way (and by extension, Luke) was a failure and that the "new" Jedi would have to be raised without the dogma of the old way.

also: if a ship at light speed will fucking obliterate anything it runs into then why the fuck aren't the First Order or the Resistance doing nothing but warping empty drone ships into each other??? even if the Resistance doesn't have the resources, the First Order sure as fuck does. this blows the whole arms race wide open. really cool visual though.

 

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Whelt
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I did wonder about the lightspeed scene. Evacuate the Resistance and then ram the cruiser into Snoke's ship - It was clearly an effective plan, so why wasn't it the plan to begin with? Was she just going to sit in the cruiser and let herself be killed, without using the opportunity to destroy the massive enemy ship?

The only possibility that comes to mind is that simply, no one has ever thought to do it. They have these complex weapons and shield systems, and no one considered that a blunt object might actually be the most effective tool. Commander Purplehair (forgot her name lol) only came up with this idea in a moment of desperation. Hux clearly didn't expect it until he saw it happening. It's a weapons innovation.

They have a chance to make this into a plot point if we see the First Order taking advantage of unmaned drone rammings in Episode IX. 

 

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TugCoat
7 minutes ago, SharkhamAsylum said:

 

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I felt like having the old Jedi books intact and recovered at the end (in the drawer from which Finn gets the blanket for Rose) was a really insulting way to renege on what I really appreciated as a point the film was making, that the traditional Jedi way (and by extension, Luke) was a failure and that the "new" Jedi would have to be raised without the dogma of the old way.

 

Spoiler

For me it hardly represents anything more than the characters decisions regarding them and what it means for their development. Luke has personal demons attached to the past he needs to grow past to find balance and Rey needs to contend against "kill all of the past" Kylo because bucking the past completely is his imbalance, more or less.

 

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The Pope
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It could be the fact that only by ramming with such a large object could you do that much damage; ramming with a Tie Fighter-sized ship could just result in a small breach in the ship that needs to be patched up, rather than completely wrecking the Supremacy.

Also, Holdo was planning to use their mothership as bait, hence why she didn't lead with the ramming; once the ship was gone, even if they dealt a lot of damage with it, the smaller ships would be open to attack. Plus if she did it while focus was on the mothership, the Supremacy could've come up with some way to block it; part of the reason the damage was so severe was because they were caught by surprise and couldn't block it.

Also, I've seen the movie twice now, and I'm still not sure if those are the Jedi books in the Falcon. It flashes by so quick, and I can't imagine why there'd randomly be a copy of the books in Han's ship.

Speaking of weird focus, in the final shot, rather than focusing on the kid's Resistance ring, I really wish more focus was placed on him grabbing the broom with the Force. A lot of people have come out saying "Wait, what? Who used the Force now? When? Huh? That last scene with the kids didn't seem necessary, why was it there?"

 

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Whelt
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I legitimately didn't notice the broom the first time, and the second time I had to specifically look for it, and even then it's barely noticeable. I think they went a little too subtle on that one.

I still don't think the scene is meant to build up to anything. It was just a way of saying "the resistance lives on" in the hearts of all of the downtrodden rather than trying to hype up this random kid as a future Force user.

 

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The Pope
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It's not to meant "THIS KID'S GONNA BE HOT SHIT", it's part of the greater theme with Rey being a nobody, that being that the Force doesn't just belong to family dynasties but that it's, well, awakened in tons of randos who will go on to make their own legends.

 

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SharkhamAsylum
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Wait the kid grabbed the broom with the Force? I thought I saw him do that but I reasoned that it must've just been lit weird.

 

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Biodegradable
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I noticed the kid at the end using the Force the first time. Git on mah level, ya half-witted, scruffy-lookin' nerf herders.

 

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MAZZ0Murder
9 hours ago, SharkhamAsylum said:

I saw The Last Jedi! I guess the best way I can articulate my feelings about it is that it's simultaneously the best and worst Star Wars movie. I have a mountain of little problems with it, and the film as a whole feels like it breaks down when you take it all in at once, but moment-to-moment it's really good and it delivers on so many incredible things.

  Reveal hidden contents

I felt like having the old Jedi books intact and recovered at the end (in the drawer from which Finn gets the blanket for Rose) was a really insulting way to renege on what I really appreciated as a point the film was making, that the traditional Jedi way (and by extension, Luke) was a failure and that the "new" Jedi would have to be raised without the dogma of the old way.

also: if a ship at light speed will fucking obliterate anything it runs into then why the fuck aren't the First Order or the Resistance doing nothing but warping empty drone ships into each other??? even if the Resistance doesn't have the resources, the First Order sure as fuck does. this blows the whole arms race wide open. really cool visual though.

 

Spoiler

But those books are collectables! Who cares if you read them!

EDIT: I also wonder why no one has ever crashed into anything during hyperspace and done that before. You think Alderaan took a lazer to the face? Guess again! That was another ship accidentally hyperspacing into the planet! The Deathstar was nothing more than a lazer pointer!

Also it may be more about aiming. Snokes ship was pretty difficult to miss. Someone changes course and you'd just fire off into hyperspace and now you're down a ship and have to backtrack!

 

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VGFM
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Also you'd still need the resources to build a hyperdrive, a large enough ship to do noticeable damage (e = mc^2), and make sure that the former has enough power and fuel to move the mass of the latter.  Plus you'd probably need some degree of armor and navigation equipment to get the ship into position in the first place and make sure it's not shot down before it can make the jump.  Oh, and once you've spent all those resources they can only be used once and their remains will be scattered so thin across the cosmos that you'll never be able to salvage any of it.

Granted I don't see why more ships don't just suicide jump into enemy vessels when they're heavily damaged (beyond the tendency for hyperdrives to get damaged when the plot says they should), but the resource cost of suicide lightspeed bombers seems comparable to that of a functioning cruiser (minus personnel and weapons), and the latter can at least be used multiple times and serve multiple functions in and out of combat.

 

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Nozdordomu

I just had a thought after talking about the movie with some friends.

Spoiler

OK, so there's been some controversy about the way Poe and Holdo's conflict is portrayed, about which of them (if either one) was right or wrong, and so on. Personally, I can accept that Poe was being too reckless and Holdo might have had a reason not to tell him her plan, although I don't think she made it easier for anyone but whatever. Here's the thing, though: Holdo's plan still fails. Once the First Order catches on to what's happening, they immediately go after the smaller vessels and leave the big ship open. You could argue that was Poe's fault for unwittingly leaking the info, but I think the enemy would've figured out anyway. So the only way for Holdo to buy the rebels more time is to do the whole hyperspace jump thing, and judging by her reactions, it didn't look like that was part of her plan at all.

In other words, Holdo and Leia admonish Poe for recklessness (probably rightfully so), but in the end, Holdo only really succeeds by doing something completely reckless, i.e. acting like Poe. I have no idea if Rian Johnson intended this, but if he did, it would add a lot more depth to their conflict.

Can I get a second opinion on this?

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JazzDanceForChildren
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This really isn't a direct answer to your question, but I feel like they could have fixed the Holdo lightspeed sequence just by having it be the plan from the start, but making it clear that there was some potential for it to go wrong. Maybe attempting to deliberately collide with a stationary or slow-moving object when jumping to lightspeed is extremely difficult and there's a good chance that the ship would miss or somehow phase through the target or something. Maybe she had some kind of advanced piloting or engineering knowledge and she was one of the only qualified people that could do it, or maybe there was some kind of failsafe to prevent the ship from making a lightspeed jump that would result in it being destroyed and only high-ranking rebels could override it. Maybe large starships have some kind of shielding that would cause objects traveling at lightspeed to bend around around them rather than collide (this might also explain why we never see any sort of lightspeed-based projectiles or bombs) and someone else would have had to deactivate or destroy the shield before the ship had the opportunity to hit them.

 

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Robotic
22 hours ago, Nozdordomu said:

I just had a thought after talking about the movie with some friends.

  Hide contents

 You could argue that was Poe's fault for unwittingly leaking the info, but I think the enemy would've figured out anyway.

Can I get a second opinion on this?

Spoiler

I guess I can only ask why you would think this? It's only when Benicio del Toro's character helps the First Order that they have any clue what's going on. There's nothing to say Holdo's plan had reason to fail otherwise.

 

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MAZZ0Murder

Something I never noticed in RotJ, that was pointed out on imgur. The moment when Vader says to Luke "Obi-Wan has taught you well." in their duel... Luke has... THE HIGH GROUND! :P

 

Started it at the moment.

EDIT:

Well that was amusing enough :P

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