The Pope

Fox's Marvel Movies: Deadpool 2 Edition

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The Pope

To be fair I don't know that much of the New Mutants, but from what I can read, it just seems like a cast of younger characters doing X-Men like stuff in their own group, kinda like the Teen Titans. But this is looking like some kind of horror film in the same way that Fant4stic was a Cronenbergian body horror, and it's like...what? Why?

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TVBForever

Aside from the obvious from Kinberg and Fox (*cough* $$$); it seems like the new rule for any obscure Marvel comic Fox touches would end up making a horror film as if Fox's own Fantastic Four/X-Men universe are like a damn mish-mash of any Hannibal, The Purge, or Saw movie.

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TVBForever

But this on the other hand...

Holy shit does it look great!

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Nozdordomu

A superhero horror film is such a weird idea that I'd like to see it done right. But if they're just going to repeat what Fant4stic did, then forget it.

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appdirect

It looks more like Stranger Things than FanFourStick.

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MAZZ0Murder
On 11/15/2017 at 9:27 PM, TV?️?️RA?️ said:

But this on the other hand...

Holy shit does it look great!

ROSS BOBART

Also nice little sneak peak :D

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TVBForever

Uh huh, surprised nobody talks about this:

http://variety.com/2018/film/news/fox-ryan-reynolds-deadpool-2-may-18-1202661632/

I'm still excited for a new Deadpool sequel, but I'm still scared shitless about the next X-Men coming out in November. And few articles indicated that (and reminder it's just from a few sources, could be a rumor, but still a very shitty excuse nonetheless) the reason why The New Mutants have been delayed is to make it more frightening.

Look, I have no clue if that decision was from the director, writer, editor, or even either Fox and Disney; which since this hasn't been brought up in this topic.

https://web.archive.org/web/20171214141817/https://thewaltdisneycompany.com/walt-disney-company-acquire-twenty-first-century-fox-inc-spinoff-certain-businesses-52-4-billion-stock-2/

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The Pope

It's pretty clear that Disney will burn Fantastic Four and X-Men to the ground and start fresh, but I'm curious what they'll do about Deadpool since everyone loves him. I could see him being incorporated into the MCU and shrugging off the canon issues, if only because Deadpool breaking the fourth wall and being a putz about stuff like canon is kinda his shtick.

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TVBForever

Well it's only up to Kevin Feigie (head honcho of Marvel Studios) to decide whether or not either X-Men, Silver Surfer or Fantastic Four needed to be rebooted for the MCU. To be fair though there might be a sliver of hope for Fantastic Four being in the MCU; though I'm sorta cynical that it's not even funny. Although Silver Surfer might be a perfect candidate for the MCU.

As for the new X-Men though, I'm worried shitless nowadays.

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The Pope

Dark Phoenix is delayed from November 2018 to February 2019, while The New Mutants is delayed from April 2018 to February 2019 and now August 2019.

Okay, yeah, Fox is just trying to save face while it prepares for the Disney acquisition. Honestly if that happens before these movies come out, will Disney even release them? Or will they just release them straight to Netflix or something?

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TVBForever

I honestly assume (and please don't take my word for it) that given the recent Disney-Fox deal, Fox themselves learned about the upcoming Infinity War so that way the studio could potential tie-in with the MCU. Plus, there have been news articles in regards to the delay of Dark Phoenix that the studio bumped it to a February release given the overwhelmingly success of the likes of Lego Batman, Black Panther, and even their own Kingsman and Deadpool. Plus, the studio and film director (also head honcho of the X-Men film universe and corporate bridge troll) Simon Kinberg wanted more extra reshoots starting in either August-September just to make the February 2019 release deadline.

As for the New Mutants, more extra reshoots and plus given that the studio wanted this to also tie-in on the MCU lore but also be a much different breed of superhero films like both Logan and the aforementioned Deadpool. And I'm assuming that this sudden release change plus negotiations was all thanks to Disney themselves, but I'm not too sure.

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The Pope

Marvel will never tie the existing X-Men movies into the MCU.

Ever.

Ever.

Why do you think they started fresh with Tom Holland and cut the Amazing series wholly out of the picture? They'll do the same with X-Men. They want a completely clean slate where they have creative control over the franchise from day one. They don't want X-Men just so they can pick through the Patrick Stewart/Hugh Jackmen-less leftovers. New Professor, new Magneto (which is a shame since those two are probably the only good post-reboot actors, I originally liked Lawrence as Mystique but she stopped giving a shit after First Class), new Wolverine, new everybody. The only character they might keep as is would be Deadpool, because a) he's recent enough that he doesn't carry years of baggage, and b) being meta about dumb continuity bullshit is kinda his gag so he could get away with being the only guy in the room who realizes he's in another continuity while his original one has been stricken out of existence.

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TVBForever

Exactly what I was thinking. Especially given Fox's own Marvel staff have been moving to the real Marvel studio over at Disney; an X-Men reboot is a much better idea. However, Fox; apart from The New Mutants and Dark Phoenix; also have 8 more planned X-Men films in script development; but by the time the Disney-Fox acquisition confirms, most (and maybe all) plans for more Fox's X-Men films will be indeed scrapped in favor of the MCU reboot (with Ryan Reynold's Deadpool being the sole exception as he's rumored to appear in future MCU films).

Who knows, by the time Disney and Fox confirm the acquisition, then they may not be able to release it theatrically and instead release them via Disney's newly formed video sharing platform (or on Netflix give or take), and even if they still plan on releasing these two films theatrically; it'll more than likely get their respective limited release without promoting them whatsoever as with Elektra, Fanf4stick or Origins; but much worse.

...and to be frank, I honestly would rather want an MCU reboot on the X-Men films than what Fox has been doing nowadays.

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The Pope

They're "planning" tons of X-Men movies in the same way they're "planning" a sequel to Trank's Fantastic Four and WB is "planning" about 15 DCEU movies.

When a studio says they're "planning" movies and throws up a bunch of names onto a slate, that means nothing. The Gambit movie has been "planned" since X-Men Origins: Wolverine back in 2009, and every year we hear "It's coming, we promise!" but it never happens. It's all empty words unless they have the meat to back it up. In DC's case, for example, Aquaman's only happening because it was pretty much done after Justice League flopped at the box office, and it was too late for them to start their desperate creative shuffle they're currently working on.

The closest thing we've had to a movie that a studio has said they're "planning" for years finally coming to fruition is the Venom movie, and that just looks like wretched pig shit.

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TVBForever

Because let's face it, it is too damn impossible to make cinematic universes nowadays. Marvel is doing excellent with their cinematic universe as with Star Wars (given that Disney is actually well-aware that with these respective well-established franchises, they need to release a good movie and not just something inherently successful).

Warner Bros. tried but failed to kickstart their cinematic universe based on the DC characters, Sony had too much difficulty with the Spider-Man cinematic universe, plus their planned Ghostbusters universe failed, Universal tried twice to reboot their Monsters, but both Dracula Untold and The Tom Cruise Mummy failed spectacularly, Paramount is trying their hands on a Hasbro universe (I'm calling it, it's going to fail hard). I mean after all Paramount and J.J. Abrams tried their hands on a Cloverfield cinematic universe, and that franchise alone is just about to be in its death bed pretty soon given the recent shitty half-baked barely-promoted Netflix film. Fuck even video game studios Ubisoft and Square Enix tried to throw their respective hats in the ring for film adaptations to their own properties; and also failed. Like is there any other reason why Hitman: Agent 47, Assassin's Creed, and the recent Tomb Raider film failed to capitalize?

Surprising that Legendary's own Godzilla universe (aka: the Monsterverse) is the only critically and commercially successful cinematic universe not from Disney. ...even though it doesn't really mean too much given that Godzilla's own universe has been an established cinematic universe for decades, even before Marvel, DC, and Star Wars.

...like I could literally be here all day talking about how making a cinematic universe will fail at times; especially pre-planning the universe before the one film's initial release.

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The Pope

MovieBob's discussed cinematic universes at length, and the major flaw that a lot of studios fail to notice is that it should only feel like you have to see all the movies to get it. You can watch Guardians of the Galaxy without having watched Ant-Man, and you can watch Captain America 2 without having watched Iron Man 3, and since the Avengers movies are generally pretty story-light, you can watch them as fun character-based action setpieces. Meanwhile, you've got Universal over here stuck on the idea that rather than giving people one good movie at a time, it'd be better to promise them "Other, better movies will be coming soon, we promise!" With that mindset, why even watch the bad "setup" movies to begin with?

Another major thing is that Marvel took 4 years and 4 individual movies to build up to the Avengers; sure DC took about the same amount of time (not necessarily by choice; Marvel waited at most 1 year between movies at the start while it took DC 3 years to figure out how the hell to get BvS off the ground and fail miserably to boot), but they had one solo movie, then one massive clusterfuck where they tried to cram in all of the setup for Justice League in at once, then Suicide Squad as some bizarre one-off, and then Justice League came out to a resounding thud.

Moral of the story: keep your pants on, guys.

Oh, and as for why the Monsterverse is the only one working, well, for starters Kong: Skull Island wasn't 2 hours of "HEY GUYS LOOK IT'S RODAN AND GHIDORAH AND MECHAGODZILLA"; they were smart and just tossed that in as a bonus in the credits. Both movies are standalone and decently good, even though Godzilla's only real outstanding quality is that last 10 minute fight.

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TVBForever

I could honestly quote one of most memorable lines coming from Yoda off of Star Wars, "Do or do not, there is no try."

Because the problem with studios is that they try to plan out the universe before the movie's release. It happened with Sony twice; one of which was announced over a year before the release of Amazing Spider-Man 2, and the other with Ghostbusters 2016; not realizing that this was just another unnecessary reboot with a so-called radical pro-feminist agenda; both these failed to make any money back worldwide despite that they were already well-known established franchises from the word go; but here lies the problem; they planned too much before release.

The same applied with Universal's Dark Universe (to this day, I still think the term "Dark Universe;" showing their then-new upcoming shared universe with their monsters sounds cringy as fuck), the Ubisoft film universe, the Square Enix film universe, the Cloverfield universe, the DCEU, and will happen with Paramount's own Hasbro universe. Why? Cause to add what you said, you need 4 extra years right after the follow-up to the first film is released just to make a cinematic shared/extended universe.

But yeah, I've rewatched both Godzilla '14 and Skull Island not too long ago and I still enjoy them.

But anyway, it's more likely that Dark Phoenix and New Mutants will fail. It was further proof with both Daredevil and Elektra; it was proven with X-Men Origins; and it happened with Fan4stic, and will more so happen with these two films.

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The Pope

Saw Deadguy 2.

It was alright. Not bad, not amazing. Pretty good.

Still, with how much these movies defecate all over the X-Men and their lore, I honestly can't see "serious" X-Men movies working ever again. If Dark Phoenix does end up happening, it's gonna tank. Hard.

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TVBForever

Came out of SkullPoopL 2 twice. I had polarizing feelings the first time watching, but by the second viewing it all of a sudden grew on me.

It terms of superhero movies, it is top among my favorite sequels; only two between Spider Man 2 and The Dark Knight.

 

Also nobody was lying, the end credits is both hilarious and phenomenal!

I will say that I've been having zero hopes for Dark Phoenix and New Mutants.

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